Join Shelby Forums Today

65 timing cover won't fit

Discussion in '1965-1970 Shelby Mustang GT350 & GT500' started by 2+2=gt350, Nov 11, 2012.

  1. 2+2=gt350

    2+2=gt350 Active Member

    Posts:
    35
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Location:
    westfield ind
    ok heres the lowdown, I installed a Cloyes double roller timing chain on my early 289 5 bolt block with mech.fuel pump eccentric installed. Went to install cover only to find out it would not fit flush. The cover was obviously hitting the eccentric and would bottom out if i removed the eccentric. I want to use the mechanical pump for originality purposes. Does anyone know if there is a "deeper" cover or do I just need to go back to an original style timing chain to remedy this problem? Any info helpful Thanks::unsure:
     
  2. BillH

    BillH Well-Known Member

    Age:
    72
    Posts:
    263
    Likes Received:
    7
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Is the fuel pump eccentric bolted flush against the upper timing gear? Last time I saw something like that the guy put the washer between the eccentric and the timing gear.
     
  3. 2+2=gt350

    2+2=gt350 Active Member

    Posts:
    35
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Location:
    westfield ind
    Made me Think :) Glad I took Pics, answer is no see attch Pic DSCI0624.jpg What I have done so far is grind eccentric down approx 1/4 inch to make cover fit but I am wondering if it was the right thing to do? Thank You Sir
     
  4. 2+2=gt350

    2+2=gt350 Active Member

    Posts:
    35
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Location:
    westfield ind
    Whoa WRONG PIC no eccentric here let me correct
     
  5. 2+2=gt350

    2+2=gt350 Active Member

    Posts:
    35
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Location:
    westfield ind
    HOOP There it is!!!!
     

    Attached Files:

  6. BillH

    BillH Well-Known Member

    Age:
    72
    Posts:
    263
    Likes Received:
    7
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Hard to tell from the photo, but if you had to grind down the fuel pump eccentric to make the timing cover fit, you better pull it back apart. The 1st issue is the fuel pump will only be riding on about half the width of the eccentric. The 2nd issue is the eccentric will not be located in the cam drive pin. The bolt alone is not designed to keep it in place. It could come lose, which will make a mess. We had that happen on a race car one time, wasn't pretty.

    Another thing to check is the camshaft end play, should be around .010 (if memory serves) if it's excessive you may have used a spacer on a cam gear that already has the spacer built in.

    That is a pretty simple area but everything needs to be absolutely correct or bad things happen.

    Good Luck
     
  7. 2+2=gt350

    2+2=gt350 Active Member

    Posts:
    35
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Location:
    westfield ind
    Sounds like GOOD advice. I'll pull it apart over holiday and check endplay and look for spacer. The pin is in place on eccentric. Looks as if i'll be buying a new eccentric and a stock timing chain. Thanks for the reply, I'll let you know what I find. Thank You:)
     
  8. 2+2=gt350

    2+2=gt350 Active Member

    Posts:
    35
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Location:
    westfield ind
    OK found the problem! The thrust plate was not ground to clear the cam timing gear! I bolted up gear to cam and it would not turn by hand, I removed gear and eccentric and found marks on thrust plate. Removed did visual inspection ground down plate reinstalled and timeing cover fits like it should! Thanks :cool:and keep this great forum going!
     

    Attached Files:

  9. BillH

    BillH Well-Known Member

    Age:
    72
    Posts:
    263
    Likes Received:
    7
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    I don't think that thrust plate was ever used on a HiPo, which is why it hit the outer edge of the timing gear. I would bolt on the upper gear without the chain and check it. As long as everything turns without binding and you have around .006 camshaft end play, you should be OK.
     
  10. 2+2=gt350

    2+2=gt350 Active Member

    Posts:
    35
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Location:
    westfield ind
    OK Thanks for the advice. So are you saying I may have the wrong thrust plate, or that there should not be one there in the first place? This engine started life as a standard 289 and I added the Hi-Po main caps. I will set camshaft end play to your specs of .006 and go from there, the end play is set from the cam gear shoulder to where it meets the thrust plate right? So if it is to tight I would have to surface grind (mill) the thrust plate where the gear meets it? Just received my fuel pump from Fred Ballard today::guitar: and I want to get project going but do not want to destroy anything in the process. I still plan on using Cloyes double roller, now that the cover fits:dance: so here are a couple of pics of his work. Thanks again for all the input.:)
     

    Attached Files:

  11. BillH

    BillH Well-Known Member

    Age:
    72
    Posts:
    263
    Likes Received:
    7
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Not necessarily the wrong thrust plate, just a later year one. (They all have to have one) The original hi-Po units didn't have the ears on the plate that cover the oil galleys, (we did have issues with racing pumps blowing out the press in plugs) the plate you are using eliminates any possibility of that happening. Which is probably why it hits the edge of the upper gear. I would bolt up the thrust plate and the upper timing gear without the chain. The camshaft should turn freely with a little end play. If you actually have a problem with too little end play you need to find another thrust plate. I have never seen one that had too little. The main thing is that you don't have too play much due to high mileage wear. Be sure to torque the cam bolt after putting some loctite on the threads.
     
  12. 2+2=gt350

    2+2=gt350 Active Member

    Posts:
    35
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Location:
    westfield ind
    OK after all the checking on why my timing cover would not fit I found one thing after another. First as original post says timing cover does not fit, red neck cure grind eccentric down, cover fits but engine will not turn by hand, remove fuel pump eccentric still does not turn. Closer examination shows the cam thrust plate rubbing on eccentric, grind down cam thrust plate and all turns wel!! Install cover still OK. Install harmonic balancer more problems. What I found oud outside of cover is that the new balancer when tightened down was hitting on the (dimples) of the timing cover. To remedy this situation I removed timing cover and ground down (dimples) to clear harmonic balancer. This was a 289 that I had converted to a 331 using SCAT stroker kit. Hope this fixes all problems.
     

Share This Page